BigDork

Bearing Arms

34 posts in this topic

They day before the election I joked I should buy stock in gun manufacturers because when Clinton is elected everyone is gonna run out to buy guns thinking she's about to ban all guns forever.

 

I should have listened to myself for the opposite reason. Trump is President and after the 7 day waiting period I'm going to be a gun owner. For the few of you who aren't FB friends and don't know, MsDork is black. Right now she's legitimately worried about the climate and how things currently are here in the US. She's even received a random, hateful FB personal message from a stranger. So we've decided it's better to have a gun just in case. It wasn't a decision we made lightly but I think it's the right one.

 

It's a bit weird though. I've been in the military for over 15 years and am still a little apprehensive about actually owning a handgun. I think part of that is my lack of familiarity. I think I would be far more at ease if we were getting an AR-15. Yes it's an assault rifle but I've fired hundreds of rounds out of a M-16A2. I am comfortable and familiar with that type of weapon. I haven't fired a pistol since I was a teenager.

 

So anyone else out there a gun owner?

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And here's what I'm getting. A Glock 17 Gen4. I did some research and this seemed like a good one to go with. I don't know a ton about handguns but from what I read this one seemed reliable and sturdy.

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Sorta kinda but not really, yet.

 

I'm far from a 'gun guy'. I don't know gun xyz from gun abc unless you're talking 1800s era.

 

That said, hEt is arguing with her brother over the inheritance of a particular gun from when her parents died. Her mom promised it to hEt, but her dad gave it to her brother before he died. It's just a cheap .22 rifle. hEt wants it because it was her MOMs.

 

I myself inherited a gun from my grandpa, but it is presently at my parents since until about a year ago, we didn't have a gun safe, and with the reconstruction that safe had to go to storage. It's a 1903 Colt .32 Saturday night special. http://www.coltautos.com/mmst_v.htm .32 Ammo can be a bear to find, but there's still some coming back from the desert and available at the gun shows. Extremely comfortable gun to shoot.

 

Also technically have a double barrel coach gun (~1830s shotgun), but we're not sure it fires.

 

I'd say buy what feels good for you/your wife.

 

We have a gun stores around that let you shoot models before you buy in attached ranges.

 

Home defense wise, a tactical shotgun is hard to beat. Self defense/conceal carry wise, that 9mm is pretty standard.

Edited by Unorthodox

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So anyone else out there a gun owner?

 

It's just such a foreign concept over here that it amazes me that you would go down that path. But different county, difference situations. You know your situation infinitely more than I do. :)

 

As kids growing up on the farm we had a 303 and 22 for pest control, and I was pretty handy with the Parker Hale back in the 90's when I was in the army.

 

But these days there is literally no need to have a weapon in Australia. Below is my security system, and to be honest, I've never had to use it.

 

89030490_l_a1.jpg

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Own a plinking rifle (22 LR with a scope - really, just plinking targets is all).

 

Have access to about 25 different handguns and another 30 odd longuns (mix of rifles and shotguns, not sure of the actual mix though). Father in law own them. Basically everybody who has died in the last 25 odd years in the family left him all their guns. I will inherit from him.

 

Couple things about handguns:

- Make sure it feels right in your hand. Really comfortable.

- strongly recommend against guns with expensive ammo as your first gun. You need to fire a lot of rounds to get used to shooting. A 9mm round costs I think 30 cents. A 45 round costs about 90 cents.

- Revolver vs Semi-auto I would almost always recommend for the revolver first for self defense. It is, generally, a safer gun to have for someone that isn't experienced with them. Of course, if it isn't comfortable to you... well, comfort comes first.

- Gun safe. Even if she plans on keeping it in her purse when she goes out to the local farmers market, or to work, or wherever - whenever she walks into the door it goes direct into the gunsafe not left in the purse.

- You have little ones - teach them gun safety at the same time as you get the gun. Don't keep it a secret from them. Nothing makes a kid want to play with something more than if it is forbidden or secret or adult only.

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As with Dale its just such an alien concept. Not just owning a gun but even gun stores. I still get a bit surprised when I see armed policemen at transport hubs but sadly they're becoming a bit too familiar.

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GK - what are your thoughts on traveling with the weapon, but not keeping it loaded? I realize that means you have a delay time of loading it before use if you really needed it, but I feel like the time lost loading a weapon is going to be very minor in the vast majority of situations in which you'd actually use a weapon than the risk of it going off in a bag or something.

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They day before the election I joked I should buy stock in gun manufacturers because when Clinton is elected everyone is gonna run out to buy guns thinking she's about to ban all guns forever.

 

I should have listened to myself for the opposite reason. Trump is President and after the 7 day waiting period I'm going to be a gun owner. For the few of you who aren't FB friends and don't know, MsDork is black. Right now she's legitimately worried about the climate and how things currently are here in the US. She's even received a random, hateful FB personal message from a stranger. So we've decided it's better to have a gun just in case. It wasn't a decision we made lightly but I think it's the right one.

 

It's a bit weird though. I've been in the military for over 15 years and am still a little apprehensive about actually owning a handgun. I think part of that is my lack of familiarity. I think I would be far more at ease if we were getting an AR-15. Yes it's an assault rifle but I've fired hundreds of rounds out of a M-16A2. I am comfortable and familiar with that type of weapon. I haven't fired a pistol since I was a teenager.

 

So anyone else out there a gun owner?

 

Should have gotten a 12 gauge pump. Pattern spreads making it easy to hit. Pellets wont travel far thru walls possibly involving a non combatant. You know I am an underemployed killer of women and children, why didn't you just ask me. :)

 

I'm living in St Louis right now very close to some undesirable areas. I have the 12 over under loaded and locked already...................

 

And if you are really concerned about owning a weapon (you should be with those babies around the house) why not pepper spray? If you ever got into a situation where you have to use the defense tool, the fall out from pepper spraying someone is a hell of a lot less than shooting someone.

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GK - what are your thoughts on traveling with the weapon, but not keeping it loaded? I realize that means you have a delay time of loading it before use if you really needed it, but I feel like the time lost loading a weapon is going to be very minor in the vast majority of situations in which you'd actually use a weapon than the risk of it going off in a bag or something.

 

It depends, A LOT, on the comfort level of the person.

 

If you are carrying around a gun for protection, it should have a loaded magazine (assuming it is a semi-auto handgun) in it. You should NOT have a round in the chamber.

 

If you are still in the process of learning about your gun, how it shoots, how it feels, etc. then you shouldn't even be carrying it on you except as you go from your car to and from the shooting range, or to the gun vault you keep it stored in.

 

If you have a revolver, you should keep one chamber empty (the one in line with the barrel and hammer), because you will need to actually manually **** the hammer or double pull the trigger (depending on make and model) to get it to shoot - neither of which will be accidental.

 

You should always keep your firearm unloaded when not in use. Always assume the firearm is loaded.

 

Even if it has a safety (many revolvers do not) do not rely on the safety to prevent accidental discharges.

 

---------------

 

I think of guns as a tool. Nothing more. They are not evil (like many people believe) and I have no irrational fears of hammers, screwdrivers, or guns. But, like all tools, they can be used for good or bad things. I heard nobody trying to outlaw bricks just because the Nazi's used them to build their gas chambers, after all, and the same can apply to guns.

 

I won't be a person who caries a gun around (at least, as our society currently stands - zombie apocalypse would change that stance). My work environment puts me around a bunch of teenagers who I wouldn't trust to not try to take it off me and shoot me just because I failed them on the test they didn't study for. I have a 1.5 year old daughter at home who things most things daddy touches (my kindle, my phone, car keys, the remote for the TV, etc.) are just toys that she has to play with herself. I don't go to the areas of my city (Detroit - usually #1 murder major city in the US, although we go back and forth with Baltimore and Washington DC for the past few years I think) that would put me in a position where I would think I would need one; and even though the High School is in one of those areas, and I do go to the gas station around the corner as needed, I have never found myself in a position where a gun would have been more useful than not (and, yes, I have been mugged at gunpoint - even shot while being mugged, and no, me having a gun would just have made things worse, not better.)

 

I can get my hands on a .45 in less than an hour if I ever had a need. Fortunately, I don't ever see the need. And thankfully, that amount of time would give me enough time to cool down if I were to ever find myself "wanting" (which, thankfully, hasn't happened).

 

That doesn't mean that I also don't understand those who do feel the need to carry a gun. I completely do. I just don't put myself into those situations.

 

I don't carry jumper cables around in my car either. But I understand many people do, and I understand why.

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hehe

 

Language filter changed c * ck - which in this case was a technical term, not a naughty word.....

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Owning a gun for personal protection is an alien concept in this part of the world.

 

In Fiji gun ownership is almost entirely illegal - not even for hunting (there a pigs and fallow deer).

 

My family in NZ has rifles for hunting - mainly bolt action 303's - Dad did have however a sweet 32-20 pump action rifle for pig hunting that had a pistol grip and a (probably highly illegally) shortened barrel.

 

In NZ hand guns are pretty much illegal - and carrying any fire arm in public will land you in jail. If transporting a rifle in a vehicle (say going hunting) it must be unloaded. the police generally prefer if the bolt is removed as well.

 

Having said that - my son really wants to do THIS when we are in the US later this year.

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It depends, A LOT, on the comfort level of the person.

 

If you are carrying around a gun for protection, it should have a loaded magazine (assuming it is a semi-auto handgun) in it. You should NOT have a round in the chamber.

 

If you are still in the process of learning about your gun, how it shoots, how it feels, etc. then you shouldn't even be carrying it on you except as you go from your car to and from the shooting range, or to the gun vault you keep it stored in.

 

If you have a revolver, you should keep one chamber empty (the one in line with the barrel and hammer), because you will need to actually manually **** the hammer or double pull the trigger (depending on make and model) to get it to shoot - neither of which will be accidental.

 

You should always keep your firearm unloaded when not in use. Always assume the firearm is loaded.

 

Even if it has a safety (many revolvers do not) do not rely on the safety to prevent accidental discharges.

 

---------------

 

I think of guns as a tool. Nothing more. They are not evil (like many people believe) and I have no irrational fears of hammers, screwdrivers, or guns. But, like all tools, they can be used for good or bad things. I heard nobody trying to outlaw bricks just because the Nazi's used them to build their gas chambers, after all, and the same can apply to guns.

 

I won't be a person who caries a gun around (at least, as our society currently stands - zombie apocalypse would change that stance). My work environment puts me around a bunch of teenagers who I wouldn't trust to not try to take it off me and shoot me just because I failed them on the test they didn't study for. I have a 1.5 year old daughter at home who things most things daddy touches (my kindle, my phone, car keys, the remote for the TV, etc.) are just toys that she has to play with herself. I don't go to the areas of my city (Detroit - usually #1 murder major city in the US, although we go back and forth with Baltimore and Washington DC for the past few years I think) that would put me in a position where I would think I would need one; and even though the High School is in one of those areas, and I do go to the gas station around the corner as needed, I have never found myself in a position where a gun would have been more useful than not (and, yes, I have been mugged at gunpoint - even shot while being mugged, and no, me having a gun would just have made things worse, not better.)

 

I can get my hands on a .45 in less than an hour if I ever had a need. Fortunately, I don't ever see the need. And thankfully, that amount of time would give me enough time to cool down if I were to ever find myself "wanting" (which, thankfully, hasn't happened).

 

That doesn't mean that I also don't understand those who do feel the need to carry a gun. I completely do. I just don't put myself into those situations.

 

I don't carry jumper cables around in my car either. But I understand many people do, and I understand why.

 

:stupid:

 

As Nugog points out (and Dale did re Aussie); self defense involving firearms is not a thing in NZ. Without wanting to overly politicising this thread I do just want to say this:

 

It annoys me; as those who are attacked in an isolated area (and more and more, not so isolated) will never have the police come to their aid in time. Guns n cars did more for making the world a safer place for women (and less combative men) than even 1st & 2nd wave feminism; and the advances they gained would really have been impossible in a world without either guns and cars.

Yet firearms are demonized in my country as we drift along in a bubble of semi-ignorance, semi-care freeness (the world is a much more black and white place when you share no land borders with another country; nor even a close "water border" like the UK and France do); and a tonne of short sightedness.

 

That's me - rant over.

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I have no issue with guns having grown up on a farm with them as "tools" plus also going through the army.

 

I see no value in weaponising the civil populace. It needlessly increases risk for little value add.

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I have no issue with guns having grown up on a farm with them as "tools" plus also going through the army.

 

I see no value in weaponising the civil populace. It needlessly increases risk for little value add.

 

Given the history of the world, I disagree. But I'm sure you guys don't want this thread hijacked with a different topic.

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I'll just put this out there......

 

Australia has had 20 years of strict gun control.......

Australia has had 20 years since last massacre.......

 

Coincidence?

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I'll just put this out there......

 

Australia has had 20 years of strict gun control.......

Australia has had 20 years since last massacre.......

 

Coincidence?

 

20 years is nothing to the big picture. And lone gunmen massacres -as awful as they are- aren't my main concern.

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And were I to live in your great country or the U.S., it's running into an Ivan Milat rather than a Martin Bryant that really concerns me in terms of current events, more limited to the West.

Not that that is my main concern either!

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I'll just put this out there......

 

Australia has had 20 years of strict gun control.......

Australia has had 20 years since last massacre.......

 

Coincidence?

 

Manipulation of data.

 

Monash University: 7 shot 2002

Churchill fire arson: 10 dead 2009

Quaker hill arson: 11 dead 2011

Sydney Siege hostage: 7 shot 2014

Cairns child killings: 8 stabbed 2015

 

But you probably meant gun specific. Which you still had several shootings.

 

One could also point out states with open carry laws, especially where open carry is a common occurrence tend to have really low mass shooting rates, which would point to old west open carry working just as well as banning. Clearly we just need to hand out guns to everyone.

Edited by Unorthodox

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One could also point out states with open carry laws, especially where open carry is a common occurrence tend to have really low mass shooting rates, which would point to old west open carry working just as well as banning. Clearly we just need to hand out guns to everyone.

 

:stupid:

 

I think every gun massacre in the US in the past 50 years -bar one- has happened in a location where guns are banned. I'll go dig for info on that if anyone wants it.

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Manipulation of data.

 

Monash University: 7 shot 2002

Churchill fire arson: 10 dead 2009

Quaker hill arson: 11 dead 2011

Sydney Siege hostage: 7 shot 2014

Cairns child killings: 8 stabbed 2015

 

But you probably meant gun specific. Which you still had several shootings.

 

One could also point out states with open carry laws, especially where open carry is a common occurrence tend to have really low mass shooting rates, which would point to old west open carry working just as well as banning. Clearly we just need to hand out guns to everyone.

 

I think when the Govt propagandas us with that phrase they actually only mean "mass shootings". And then only with high powered guns. But end of the day, I still don't see the justification of arming the civilian populace. Just unnecessarily increases risk. Besides, I'd rather smash a guy's face in with a baseball bat. More rage pleasing. :lol:

 

PS: the Monash uni guy got off all charges due to "mental impairment" so technically that one didn't happen. :p

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PS: the Monash uni guy got off all charges due to "mental impairment" so technically that one didn't happen. :p

 

And the Police shot most the people in the Sydney Siege when they stormed in, so it didn't technically either. ;)

 

Personally I'd like to see some kind of gun education as mandatory. It's not the mass shootings that piss me off so much as the random 8 year old accidentally shooting his friend/sibling/neighbor/etc I find troubling.

 

Interestingly, I've witnessed the corporate policy shift on what to do if you find yourself in a shooting from hide/barricade to fight back over the last few years.

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And the Police shot most the people in the Sydney Siege when they stormed in, so it didn't technically either. ;)

 

I'd question your source of info too. There was only 3 deaths in the Sydney siege: the shooter (by police), a hostage (by the shooter) and a second hostage (by police).

 

http://www.lindtinquest.justice.nsw.gov.au/

 

It's not the mass shootings that piss me off so much as the random 8 year old accidentally shooting his friend/sibling/neighbor/etc I find troubling.

 

This is one of the main reasons I don't see the need to arm the civilian populace. Accidents, not malice.

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I didn't say deaths. I said shot. Police shot 4 hostages, one police officer, and the shooter.

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