raf0485

Here's what I'd like to see.

23 posts in this topic

The game has wheat, sugar, corn and rice, right? Well, historically, these foods have been used for more than one purpose. I think you know what I mean: alocohol. Wine is the only alcohol resource in the game. Wheat, sugar and corn can all be used for making alcoholic beverages. Why not add those? Perhaps they could make a new brewery or distillery tile improvement. That way, you could choose between two different benfits, one of a luxury or that of a food resource. Or, it's altogether possible that they could make a new building that serves that purpose. In addition, I believe that coffee and tea need to make an appearance as resources. These could give a plus one happiness and a plus one production bonus (considering that these beverages essentially pulled the west out of the middle ages. Imagine an industrial world where everyone was drunk in factories because you couldn't drink the water and the only clean beverage to drink was beer. Not a pretty picture. Not good for production). That rant in the commas there brings me to a next point. Perhaps civs who choose to brew beer and distill liquors should suffer a production penalty for it. In my eyes, production is almost everything. Unhappy people are unproductive. But drunk factory workers and forklift drivers are just dangerous. I think the religion aspects of the game are great. But, I think fanaticism is underrepresented. You remember Civ II? It had a fanaticism (or maybe it was theocracy, I'm not 100% certain) civic that I really liked. Not only did you automatically get an extra 10% taxes paid as tithes, but if one of your cities fell, BAM, fanatical militias pop up everywhere. This could possibly be tied to civics or perhaps state religions (certain belief systems are more prone to violent fanaticism than others, although Firaxis would definitely try to skirt away from anything that may make a certain church or religion 'look bad'). For example, Universal Suffrage could spawn 2 to 3 militia units with the capture of a city (depending on the size of the city and the happiness of its residents), where a communist type government (with its almost religious ideology) could spawn 4 to 5 partisans ( I think the name of the unit should probably vary based on the system of government or religious belief system held). Also, I think it might be neat to make the government systems a bit more realistic. By this, I mean that if you are the 'president' of a democratic nation who takes that nation into an unpopular conflict, cause major economic problems by spending all your time concerned with that war, and not with the economy, and so on, the people of your nation should have the ability to vote you out of office. Or, if you're a very unpopular king, and overly oppress and beat your people, they should be able to depose you. I think this would make the game more realistice, and force you to pay closer attention to approval ratings. Also, the possibility of being forced into a civil war is very interesting, and a feature I would love to see. In conclusion, I'd like to see a few new resources and their benfits, and I'd like to see a bit more realism in the game play (not too much, though. Too much can make the game unenjoyable).

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I think you should think more before writing. That's one of a hell post in there, gigantic.

 

All your ideas ARE good, but you did forget one thing:

 

Civ is a game.

 

If we include beer, sake and such in the game, Firaxis would need to increase the Rate of the game, limiting the customers. Or you didn't missed the most-ancient-work-in-the-world (prostitution)?

 

Myself, I would include those, both beverages and whores, but with penalties to "show teenagers that they don't have only good sides", like +1 Happy -1 Health (Drinking is not good for your liver; STDs...) We could include tabacco too (+1 :), -1 health).

 

Fanatics... This was out because of the increase rants against the fanatic terrorists. I too, liked the fanatics game-wise, and every religion could have one military unit (hassassins for Islam, crusaders for Christianity, monk warriors... you get the idea) but, again, Firaxis is a little afraid of negative repercussions if they include this as a civic option.

 

Hope I made myself clear and not rude.

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Admittedly, there are negative effects to all these things. Some of my ideas would make the game a bit less playable. All the more reason to be thrilled about the fact that I'm not making the game, just indicating what I would like to see. I understand what you're saying about the fanatics. You really don't want to anger anyone. But, at the least, you could make ideology factor in. Like my suggestions about the militia and partisan units I proposed. My ideas aren't perfect or polished, they're just ideas. Take them, or leave them.

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You do somewhat have the 'fanatic' element included when the civ is in Theocracy +2 xp. But I don't think that we will return to Civ 2's Fundamentalism Civic with the ability to build Fanatics anytime soon.

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On fanatics: Maybe just give a bonus to theocracy for recruiting spies? (Then re-balance if needed, of course).

 

About the OP: I admit i didnt read it to the end and rather jumped to the second in order to get what this is about. Hint: Break it down in paragraphs. Despite not watching TV, i am, like most people, infected by some mental sickness, that makes me get kinda scarred by big blocks of texts.

 

About Religious-UUs: If one would bind them to the tech of the religion, instead of the religion itself, and make each one suitable to the approximate time in which said tech is being researched, they could be made interchangable with the ´choose religion´ option from the advanced start-game settings - thus they would be PC. So whatever religion it is, that is tied to the tech theology, they get crusaders. If you play with ´choose religion´ on, it could be islam or hinduism getting them.

 

Related: Each religious-UU should have the ability to erase religions and there should be a religion-threshold, determind by civics, surpassing which would have negative consequences on your city. The colors of the civs should depend on the religions spread in them, mixed with a unique default tone.

 

Ressources: I´d rather have the model expand in depth (include quantities in some simple manner) than width (include more ressouce-types). I think only after the first, the latter will really be worth it. It kinda sucks when you loose a happy-ressource and have most of your cities live near the cap, that ALL of them get into revolt. With multiple effects for each ressouce, this gets even more intense. Maybe ressouces should only work on a per city base? THEN you could include ALOT of them. Of course you should be able to ´export´ your surplus ressources from any of your cities to another (and maybe with it all the extras it gives, e.g. +2food). Corps would have to get remodeled and buildings reblanced for that of course.

 

Additional buildings: The way the game balances buildings vs. units and wonder is okay for me as is (on epic). BUT, one could have a game-speed setting, in which the turn-number is increased, but not the hammer/beaker costs. Instead more buildings, techs and such are in. If the normal game has 500 tunrs and 80 techs, the marathon+ one could have 800 and 120 techs or whatnot. This would require the AI to act on a generalized basis (like not regard ´university´ and ´education´ as desireable, but ´the next science-building´ and ´the tech that allows me to build it´) - i dunno what the AI can or cant do though.

 

Another thing: Maybe have a game option for a ´flat´ game, without any civ/leader advantages - no traits, no starting techs, no UUs and UBs. Just an option.

Edited by Mr. Scruffy

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A tip to the OP. Paragraphing. It's easier to read smaller chunks of text, than to read one big blob. Even if there is the same amount of words.

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Which is no gurantee, that people will actually read them. But I assume, Grey Fox, that you already know this. :p

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Thank you for your constructive criticism on my writing. I admit that I did not properly organize my thoughts before creating the thread. I apologize for that.

 

One other thing I'd like to see is a regicide game option. Quite often wars are faught simply to overthrow a regime (like the Iraq War). Maybe a leader unit would be called for (there is nothing I would like more than to capture Julius Caesar and execute him after his repeated provocation of the 'peace-loving' Celtic peoples) that you could kill to end the war, making that nation your vassal with all new leadership.

 

Additionally, the siege units in the game are lacking. I don't want to ONLY be able to bombard a city's defenses, but would like to bombard the units as well; as in RTW. I think this should really be a standard part of the game, as it was in past installments.

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On the siege weapons: I assume you know about colleteral damage? Just asking.

 

Regicide: This one is a bit complicated, mainly, because there is no real equivalance to a civ´s leader in civ. They never die, get elected out of office. Thus a regicide option (other than to just add a unit and make the destruction of it the end of your civ) would entail a change of concept regarding leaders - a civ should be led by a succession instead of just one all the time. The only way, i could imagine this, would entail to open all leaders to all civs, in order to make for a viable variance and then introduce elections and leader deaths along side with a spy mission ´regicide´. The mechanism by which the new leader is chosen could be random, based on some AI choice or a player choice with or without limitations defined by some other mechanism... The interior policies of a civ could well be a whole new field to explore and expand the franchise upon. If you change leadership like maybe a dozen times in a game, would that be that bad? I dunno, could be interesting.

 

As for the problem in the case you described: You COULD declare war on JC, and vassalize him. That would automaitically end his war with the celts. Then you could gift him back the cities you took in the war and dont want to keep (or you coud just raze them to begin with). All that in Civ4 (BTS) mind you. (You have to keep JC under a certain territory/population threshold in order to keep him as vassal though).

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Yes, I know about the collateral damage feature, but it would be nice to bombard enemy units without risking the loss of my siege units (which I almost never build enough of, anyway). I also know that I can force JC into capitulation, but I would rather KILL him, not just disgrace him. After just so many wars with him, the grudge becomes personal, and I'd rather see his neck stretched than his head hang in disgrace.

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Oh, and I'd like for the game to have UAV's and armored cars (early industrial era version of a tank). From what I've heard, UAV's (Unmanned Aerial Vehicles) are becoming a much more important weapon of war. They are also creating unmanned groung vehicles, too. Now, the armored cars were the earliest tanks, but I think the game misses an important step in the development of the modern tank by leaving them out.

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I'd kind of like to see a campaign mode where players whould make their own civilization and possible a UU/UB. They would earn their traits instead of picking them based on what they did, IE if they built 4-5 cities they would gain imp. or if they worked their land a lot they would gain exp.

 

Another idea i had was having multiple leaders for a country instead of just one. (This just applies to campaign mode) IE. One leader would only be in power until he died of old age/war/etc etc.. and then a new leader would take his place. The player would have to then choose an hier to the throne (A general, a son...) Just like in real life if the leader didn't have an heir there could be dispute over the throne and possibly send you into a civil war.

 

This is just an idea, and i wanted to see what people thought about it.

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I like the idea of the possibility of changing traits that you pick up over time. Historically, it's very accurate. For instance, at one point there was an idea of an American Empire. Resultantly, the US took over territories like Puerto Rico, the Phillipines, Hawaii, not to mention the fact that wars with Mexico resulted in the culmination of Manifest Destiny. After the period of imperialism, the US went into isolation which was broken by WWI. And, all of this happened in less than 100 years.

 

I've also thought for some time that there needs to be some sort of succession within the game. That is to say that there should be some way for you to be voted out, overthrown in a coup, or other forms of leaving power. Of course, it wouldn't be much fun to play the first turn of an ancient-era game, die on the next turn and thusly lose power. That would stink, to put it lightly. But, perhaps your leaderhead and traits would change with it. I know it sounds like I'm 'downing' on the idea, but I'm really not. I like it, but I'm not sure (personally) how it could be worked out.

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No, it's perfectly fine, you bring up a good point I didn't explain myself well. What i was thinking was that you would just change leaders, the player wouldn't lose any control of the civilization just the current leader. For example, I would be playing with Joao II and he would die then Joao III would take control or possibly someone else in the government, But the human would still be playing the gmae. I thought having new traits ever 50-60 turns might be a +

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I would think that it would keep the game fresh and interesting.

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nice idea destroyer it would be better if the player who lost control of his civ went into civil war for x amount of turns and was unable to build anything or work any tiles during this time and if no succesor to the throne was available the player became another players vasal :)

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Thats exactly what happens in the new civ MOD Rise of mankind http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=9301

 

Download that if you can, It is unbelievable, sort of like a whole new civ. theres

* 288 Techs in tech tree

* 300+ Units

* 189 Buildings

* 88 Wonders

* 36 National wonders

* 54 Civic options

* 29 Unit categories, modern units are superior to ancient units

* 28 New resources

* 26 Pre made maps included: 7xEarth, 2xMars map, 2xMediterranean, Europe, Demographica (Europe), New Zealand, 2xEurasia, North&South America maps, Australia, Antarctica, Orion and Sirius fictional planet maps, Colonization (1500AD America) scenario, 2xTamriel (Elderscrolls), Earthsea, Japan+Korea map

* 22 New Leaders

* 19 New Improvements for terrain/resources

* 6 New route types

* 5 New Civilizations (55 with extra civ addon pack)

* 5 New Projects

* 4 New Citizen types

* 4 New Religions

2 New Civic categories

* 2 New Map sizes: Giant (54% bigger than Huge), Gigantic (50% bigger than Giant ie. 134% bigger than Huge)

* 2 New Gamespeed: Blitz 215 turns, Snail 3000 turns

* 1 New terrain type: Marsh

* AI Autoplay

* Better BTS AI 0.78c (includes Unofficial patch)

* Corporation specific buildings

* Civic specific buildings

* Dynamic Civ Names

* Enhanced Interface (BUG 3.6 mod)

* Ethnically Diverse Units

* Ethnic Diverse Citystyles

* Faster expansion in late game: Colonists and Pioneers build cities with preset buildings

* Fight in the future era with futuristic units

* Influence Driven War

* Inquisition, destroy religions

* Modified Civics

* Modified Religions (each religion is more unique)

* More events (about 60)

* More game alerts, extra information about cities and diplomacy options

* New promotions (for air units too)

* New unit flags for Civilizations

* RevolutionDCM 2.5

* Advanced Combat Odds 1.0

* Ranged Bombardment

* Sevopedia

* Super Spies (promotions for spies)

* Supports maximum of 50 players

* Tech conquest, conquering enemy cities boosts your research

* Tech diffusion, civs can't fall too far behind in tech race

* Unit order enhancements, icons show each units current task

* Upgradeable buildings

* User configurable options (see: BUG options, Rise of Mankind Config.ini and Revolution.ini)

 

Ya, WOW! UNfortunatly it's not compatible with multiplayer gaming at the moment, but it is extremely fun to play in 1 Player. Honestly i strongly reccomend it, it is like a CIV V beta.

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raf, if Firaxis included a bottle in the Civ box to illustrate the concept of resources that would be cool.

Edited by Lancer

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Ah, but then, they'd have to restrict the people who could play the game. Maybe they could send out a coupon for a free bottle, though. I'd be first in line to buy that game.

 

Honestly, I'm quite eager to see it come out, though I would be disappointed if UAVs are not included. They are the future of warfare. Also, the Pentagon is going to be testing a type of ground-drone in a few years (the scary part is that they plan on still being in Iraq AND Afghanistan at that time. This war has no end because it has no clearly defined goals.)

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Don't worry about Pentagon plans too much. They likely have plans for an invasion by Monaco. ;) Its their job to be ready for anything. Consider all the cold war plans related to and including Russia. None of them ever came to anything.

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Maybe. But that kind of talk creeps me out just the same.

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They should include the inquisition like they had in the Charmalenge (Sp?) mod as a special unit for those under a theocracy. Since non-state religions are not spread, I think you should be able to actually extract them, sort of like the fanatic in other civs.

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I think you should think more before writing. That's one of a hell post in there, gigantic.

 

All your ideas ARE good, but you did forget one thing:

 

Civ is a game.

 

If we include beer, sake and such in the game, Firaxis would need to increase the Rate of the game, limiting the customers. Or you didn't missed the most-ancient-work-in-the-world (prostitution)?

 

Anno 1603 series had that memorable line "Sir, the alcohol is almost gone!" and I think still got an E rating.

 

I do think we should be wary of over complicating the game. OTOH I like coffee and the other stimulants having a role.

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